In an unexpected mask off “secure” email and VPN provider Proton took the stance of siding with the fascist MAGA Reps. Proton’s services are no option for me and many others any longer. Let’s collect and discuss alternatives (E2E encrypted email and VPN) here 🔐👇

Always try to provide:

-Server location (jurisdiction)

-Governance

-Integrity/trustworthiness/transparency

-User experience/ease of use (grade 1 to 10, lets take Proton as a benchmark with an 8)

-Pricing and links

If you know alternative setups, feel free to share, too.

#ProtonExodus

Background: https://lemmy.ca/comment/13913116

Edit:typo

  • ziproot@lemmy.ml
    1·
    2 months ago

    Server locations: Riseup is in the US (Washington state), so keep that in mind. Disroot is in the Netherlands (part of the EU).

    Governance: Riseup: Look at their “about us” page. Disroot: Look at their “about” page. The terms of service are more detailed. tl;dr: As far as I can tell, these are run by leftists.

    Integrity/Transparency: I have no idea how to grade this.

    Ease of Use: Subjective. Riseup VPN is just: install the client, turn it on or off. Disroot is much better with a mail client of some kind, so if you already use one, it’s probably a 10, otherwise, the webmail server isn’t that great. Disroot also requries manual encryption (I’m biased here because I use Kmail which makes PGP really easy to use).

    Pricing and Links: Free https://riseup.net/en/vpn https://disroot.org/en/services/email

    tl;dr: Use collective-run services, not corporate-run services

    • perestroika@lemm.ee
      1·
      2 months ago

      Regarding e-mail: “riseup.net” requires that a long-time user vouch for a new user and invite them. If the new user quickly turns into a complaint magnet (there’s a coming-of-age period after which their actions are considered their own), both the user and the inviter will be held responsible (kicked off the service). I think (hope) they aren’t so strict with VPN, but they have limited people and could not administer a mess made by a big bunch of people.

      Needless to say, none of my (anarchist) comrades have ever been kicked off RiseUp, but they don’t send spam or threats, they just send their cat pictures encrypted with GPG, causing the authorities endless work. :)

      Just like every reasonable service, RiseUp has a few technical mechanisms to ensure they aren’t compromised (disk and inbox encryption, etc) but obviously those can’t help against a dedicated and well-resourced adversary.

      So, whatever e-mail server you use - use PGP / GPG. :) Then the adversary must compromise your device. If you are hardcore, encrypt and sign on an offline device. Then the adversary must breach the air gap.

      (I used to sign releases for some anonymity-related project years ago. Those were the times when I seriously took measures because others depended on me. Currently, not so much.)

      P.S. As for the lack of resources at RiseUp: this can be alleviated by donating to them. Which reminds me, I should set up a small regular donation to their representative organization in the EU.

  • HappyFrog@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    1·
    2 months ago

    I’ll still continue using proton, as I haven’t seen them staying from their goal just yet, but I’d love to see some alternatives non the less.

  • Timber@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    1·
    1 month ago

    systemli.org

    • Germany (I think)
    • Politically leftist
    • Very nice people
    • User experience 8, works fine and people put a lot of effort in
    • It’s free, but you need an invite code
  • Clbull@lemmy.world
    1·
    2 months ago

    If they think Dollar Store Hitler is going to stand up for small businesses then they’re about to have a rude awakening.

    • 100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it
      1·
      2 months ago

      Tech bros aren’t exactly known for a nuanced understanding of whatever isn’t bleeps and blips: that’s what you get when the educational system is nothing more than a pipeline for employment

  • vga@sopuli.xyz
    0·
    2 months ago

    Apple has recently declared that they’re keeping their DEI programs in contrast to other tech companies, so I suppose Lemmy crowd would approve that? Their CEO being openly gay since 2014 probably works as some sort of a guarantee, at least as long as he keeps being the CEO.

    So I’ll suggest: Apple hardware + icloud. User experience (with apple hardware) 10/10. Pricing: Hardware price + monthly cost. Integrity: who knows, but they seem to deriving their income from their devices more than many other things.

    Monthly cost depends on geographical location and storage size, but in EU area per month:

    • 5GB is free
    • 50GB = 1 euro
    • 200GB = 3 euros
    • 2TB = 10 euros

    That storage and cost can be shared with up to 5 family members.

    I used this for a long time and it worked really really well. But it really does practically depend on having Apple devices, preferably on every level. I recently moved to Proton because I wanted to move to Linux, but I do miss the UX and reliability quite a lot. Icloud’s web service isn’t bad though but wasn’t good enough for me.

    • NekuSoul@lemmy.nekusoul.de
      1·
      2 months ago

      If anything I’d say that the lesson to be learned from this should be the exact opposite: No company is safe forever, so you should choose based on how easy it is to switch.

      Chaining yourself to a single company all the way from the services you use down to the OS and even the hardware is only making it worse. Particularly when Apple is already aggressively anti-consumer on a lot of fronts.

  • UntitledQuitting@reddthat.com
    0·
    2 months ago

    This may sound drastic but really I think the only move for Proton is fire Andy. They’re a non-profit, the board need to step in. He has single-handedly cost the company both current and potential customers by just not being smart enough to keep his mouth shut. This makes him an idiot, and an idiot as CEO is not a good look (see: anything musk)

    • vga@sopuli.xyz
      1·
      2 months ago

      I’m not going to change from Proton because of this, but what you’re suggesting is probably not a bad idea. CEOs are and should be easy to replace and mistakes like this are pretty standard reason why CEOs get booted.

      edit removed some rather incriminating, unverified claims about Andy Yen